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Swashbucklers losing hide by AoE too much...

AuthorMessage
Captain
Oct 26, 2012
524
I agree our hide spell is powerful, and if there is nothing to bring us out of hiding, then we could be OP. But more and more these days the chances of even using our 2x hidden damage are becoming slim, too slim in fact. It seems that this spell is in a way banned from the arena, simply because it is so easy to bring us out of hiding.

So I have made some random suggestions of when and when we can't be affected by damage while being hidden.

SPELLS THAT WONT BRING US OUT OF HIDING:
-Infinite or very long range spells that hit the target when used such as the barrage series, musketeer bomb series, mojo storm series.
-AoE effects such as fires, traps or bombs that are activated only if the caster decides to use the power that activated these effects to hit the swashbuckler.

SPELLS THAT BRING US OUT OF HIDING:
-Limited Range spells, such as Bonnie Anne blast
-AoE effects such as fires, traps or bombs that are activated only if the caster decides to use the power that activated these effects to be at least one square radius away from swashbuckler.

NOTES:
The AoE spells listed above are examples after a swashbuckler is hidden. If the opponent has already trapped or sorrounded the swash buckler with fires and traps before the swash is hidden, then damage will still make the swash come out of hiding.

Buccaneers and Witchdoctoctors and possibly privateers may need new spells as well to cope with this. I think musks will be fine.
Gunner's Mate
Aug 08, 2010
288
Golden Guardian on Jan 14, 2014 wrote:
I agree our hide spell is powerful, and if there is nothing to bring us out of hiding, then we could be OP. But more and more these days the chances of even using our 2x hidden damage are becoming slim, too slim in fact. It seems that this spell is in a way banned from the arena, simply because it is so easy to bring us out of hiding.

So I have made some random suggestions of when and when we can't be affected by damage while being hidden.

SPELLS THAT WONT BRING US OUT OF HIDING:
-Infinite or very long range spells that hit the target when used such as the barrage series, musketeer bomb series, mojo storm series.
-AoE effects such as fires, traps or bombs that are activated only if the caster decides to use the power that activated these effects to hit the swashbuckler.

SPELLS THAT BRING US OUT OF HIDING:
-Limited Range spells, such as Bonnie Anne blast
-AoE effects such as fires, traps or bombs that are activated only if the caster decides to use the power that activated these effects to be at least one square radius away from swashbuckler.

NOTES:
The AoE spells listed above are examples after a swashbuckler is hidden. If the opponent has already trapped or sorrounded the swash buckler with fires and traps before the swash is hidden, then damage will still make the swash come out of hiding.

Buccaneers and Witchdoctoctors and possibly privateers may need new spells as well to cope with this. I think musks will be fine.
I definitely agree. In pvp, you might aswell discard your single target hides since they're so useless if the pirate's alive. We only have a slight advantage with them on Buccaneers, with no aoe powers. But every other class has an aoe that pops us out from hiding (swash dance of steel if standing next to an object and poison). But i say it only applies to swashbucklers. Why? Imagine a witchdoctor who trained walk in shadows (3 round hide accessable via class training) and they were immune to gunnery etc. It just doesn't seem fair that they would be immune to privateers bombs as well as us, there should be a talent called "Stealth" that you train for swashbucklers only that makes it so you can't be hit by infinite barrages, bombs or storms, and the later versions Stealthy2,3 have a 50% then a 25% of taking you out of hiding when hit by anything, and increased damage whilst hidden.

Merciless Jean Percy, 65
Merciless Jack Ramsey, 65
Merciless Cass Spencer, 22
Captain
May 13, 2011
564
i dont have any problems like that. my problem with hiding is my companions who can hide reveal themselves through epics. i cant tell how many times keisuke blew his cover because of the flanking epic
Admiral
Oct 27, 2009
1439
K Isle thought that being invisible was such a strong power that they made swashbucklers visible by the other side when they are stealthed. Yes, some attacks will not target a hidden player, but if there are so many attacks that can hit a hidden player that the stealth advantage is erased, why not make it real. It's a strategy game. Who's played "Battleship?" You can't see where the ships are, but you have an idea where they might be and can hit them. Same thing here. See the swash disappear, target the area between that point and a likely target. The attacks they have give you a good idea of places they'd like to be going. In PVE, the other side plays against you as if they have no idea where you are when stealthed. If a stealthed player triggers an epic sometimes, that seems fair, like the stealthed player misstepped and made a noise, or passed too close and was detected or if they get in the way of a mass hit.
Captain
Oct 26, 2012
524
Calamity Finch on Jan 17, 2014 wrote:
K Isle thought that being invisible was such a strong power that they made swashbucklers visible by the other side when they are stealthed. Yes, some attacks will not target a hidden player, but if there are so many attacks that can hit a hidden player that the stealth advantage is erased, why not make it real. It's a strategy game. Who's played "Battleship?" You can't see where the ships are, but you have an idea where they might be and can hit them. Same thing here. See the swash disappear, target the area between that point and a likely target. The attacks they have give you a good idea of places they'd like to be going. In PVE, the other side plays against you as if they have no idea where you are when stealthed. If a stealthed player triggers an epic sometimes, that seems fair, like the stealthed player misstepped and made a noise, or passed too close and was detected or if they get in the way of a mass hit.
I like your thoughts on the battleship strategy. However we still can't move after we hide until the next turn. Therefore they still bomb us because we are in the same position. It seems to me the main reason KI did this was because of our 2x damage. So here I go making some random spell ideas, that will greatly benefit the swash class whilst not being OP. They are not confusing like the idea I made before, and are very easy to implement in the game.

NEW HIDING SPELLS PLAN:
-Say we use assassin mist that lasts for five turns. For the first 3 turns we are immune to absolutely everything, except fire and musk traps. However if we attack with in the first 3 turns it will be 1x or normal damage. The final 2 turns will activate 2x damage, however we can be brought of hiding via the normal cheap easy ways like barrage which is the most annoying thing ever (especially when the enemy has like 5 of them sometimes).

-A note on musketeer traps. We can be brought out of hiding like this. However they must remain in shared territory (like not enemy territory or their territory). Does not apply to ship combat. The reason I want this is so that they don't place a hindrance right next to me. However they can use their invisible traps in the shared zone and have a high chance of making me pop out of hiding. Imagine I hide and I can't move. And then they use their own version of barrage .

Invisibility question and suggestions:
I hear musks are making their traps invisible soon. I think if they do that we should do as calamity finch said. Make us invisible too! We also need to be invisible to the crowd (and musk traps should also be invisible to the crowd as well). I don't need a fool of a took whispering my position to the opposition.
Pirate Overlord
Mar 10, 2009
6204
Golden Guardian on Jan 31, 2014 wrote:
I like your thoughts on the battleship strategy. However we still can't move after we hide until the next turn. Therefore they still bomb us because we are in the same position. It seems to me the main reason KI did this was because of our 2x damage. So here I go making some random spell ideas, that will greatly benefit the swash class whilst not being OP. They are not confusing like the idea I made before, and are very easy to implement in the game.

NEW HIDING SPELLS PLAN:
-Say we use assassin mist that lasts for five turns. For the first 3 turns we are immune to absolutely everything, except fire and musk traps. However if we attack with in the first 3 turns it will be 1x or normal damage. The final 2 turns will activate 2x damage, however we can be brought of hiding via the normal cheap easy ways like barrage which is the most annoying thing ever (especially when the enemy has like 5 of them sometimes).

-A note on musketeer traps. We can be brought out of hiding like this. However they must remain in shared territory (like not enemy territory or their territory). Does not apply to ship combat. The reason I want this is so that they don't place a hindrance right next to me. However they can use their invisible traps in the shared zone and have a high chance of making me pop out of hiding. Imagine I hide and I can't move. And then they use their own version of barrage .

Invisibility question and suggestions:
I hear musks are making their traps invisible soon. I think if they do that we should do as calamity finch said. Make us invisible too! We also need to be invisible to the crowd (and musk traps should also be invisible to the crowd as well). I don't need a fool of a took whispering my position to the opposition.
Lol. Thoroughly delighted with your reference in the quote in your last line. Well played.
Admiral
Oct 27, 2009
1439
Having the musketeer traps hidden seems right, too. It bothered me when they were also visible. Question: will traps be invisible to both sides? Even if they don't do damage to the friendly side, people might stand on them blocking the trap, however that might be a fair hazard to balance the invisibility. I know, it's not a big thing in small fights with an attentive team, but in the bigger fights might happen more.