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witch hunter

2
AuthorMessage
Lieutenant
Dec 19, 2011
133
Darth JT on Oct 6, 2015 wrote:
Again, because there is a fist icon, you are assuming it only reduces weapon power, this is not accurate. I have seen and tested this, it reduces spell attacks by half. Hence the talent being called Witch Hunter, not Melee Hunter or Weapon Hunter.

Already troubled class? Other people are saying now because of Old Scratches Boost, Witch Doctors are ranked 2 in PVP, so which is it? Impossible to defeat any melee class with witch hunter trained? Impossible? really, so no witchdoctor is winning at all, or is this an extreme exaggeration?

WitchDoctor's also get teleport so you don't always have to run everywhere. Mojo Storm, a spell that hits 9 squares and can naturally do over 600 damage to all 9 squares, more when boosted. again, you are over exaggerating which is not helping your cause.

You do realize that it takes 5 practice points to train witch hunter, sounds to me, like that is 5 practice points well used if you can "Always" defeat any witchdoctor of any skill.
Also, I will gladly spend 5 practice points to get an epic that works like Witch Hunter does, except against melee. "Melee Hunter" would be perfect.
Lieutenant
Nov 21, 2010
103
Darth JT on Oct 6, 2015 wrote:
Again, because there is a fist icon, you are assuming it only reduces weapon power, this is not accurate. I have seen and tested this, it reduces spell attacks by half. Hence the talent being called Witch Hunter, not Melee Hunter or Weapon Hunter.

Already troubled class? Other people are saying now because of Old Scratches Boost, Witch Doctors are ranked 2 in PVP, so which is it? Impossible to defeat any melee class with witch hunter trained? Impossible? really, so no witchdoctor is winning at all, or is this an extreme exaggeration?

WitchDoctor's also get teleport so you don't always have to run everywhere. Mojo Storm, a spell that hits 9 squares and can naturally do over 600 damage to all 9 squares, more when boosted. again, you are over exaggerating which is not helping your cause.

You do realize that it takes 5 practice points to train witch hunter, sounds to me, like that is 5 practice points well used if you can "Always" defeat any witchdoctor of any skill.
I am sorry, but it appears that we are not talking about the same game.

Again, because there is a fist icon, you are assuming it only reduces weapon power, this is not accurate. I have seen and tested this, it reduces spell attacks by half. Hence the talent being called Witch Hunter, not Melee Hunter or Weapon Hunter.

You should test this again. I tested this with my friend and we ended with same result, only weapon power is decreased, spell powers damage is the same. Even witch Hunter attack is not reduced (this makes me to believe that witch hunter is boosted by spell power).

Already troubled class? Other people are saying now because of Old Scratches Boost, Witch Doctors are ranked 2 in PVP

Maybe that is your problem, that you are listening to other people. I am frequent in the PvP arena and I based my opinion and arguments from my experience, as others in this thread that are on same page with me, who I also see in the arena all the time. Old Scratch is available to anyone and it boosts wide range of powers, not just WD's (Big Guns, Gunnery, Artillery, Valors Armor, Heals, Wound effect from Assassin strikes, etc.)

You do realize that it takes 5 practice points to train witch hunter

I am not sure where did you get this info from, but it takes only one practice point to learn Witch Hunter, and it can be learnt by any class from one of the new Clandestine trainers.

I am more then happy to hear your side of the story, but please check your facts before you make an argument. Posting arguments about the stuff you heard isn't going to help anyone. And we, who played as witchdoctor, are trying our best to share our own experience in this thread because, in our opinion, witch hunter talent in the arena acts more like a nullification of a whole class then just a counter. None other class can be put into position like WD is now because of this. Like I said before, imagine that melee class take 3x bigger hit whenever tries to attack.

Sincerely,
Stubborn Duncan Freeman
Bosun
Dec 16, 2012
331
Darth JT on Oct 6, 2015 wrote:
Again, because there is a fist icon, you are assuming it only reduces weapon power, this is not accurate. I have seen and tested this, it reduces spell attacks by half. Hence the talent being called Witch Hunter, not Melee Hunter or Weapon Hunter.

Already troubled class? Other people are saying now because of Old Scratches Boost, Witch Doctors are ranked 2 in PVP, so which is it? Impossible to defeat any melee class with witch hunter trained? Impossible? really, so no witchdoctor is winning at all, or is this an extreme exaggeration?

WitchDoctor's also get teleport so you don't always have to run everywhere. Mojo Storm, a spell that hits 9 squares and can naturally do over 600 damage to all 9 squares, more when boosted. again, you are over exaggerating which is not helping your cause.

You do realize that it takes 5 practice points to train witch hunter, sounds to me, like that is 5 practice points well used if you can "Always" defeat any witchdoctor of any skill.
Its definitely weapon power, never has it been anything but weapon power and it was not in the update notes as far as I can tell. As for that teleport comment, teleport where? the arenas are not exactly large. Also, you can also get witch hunter through a pet, just saying. And frankly, while 600 damage to all nice squares sounds nice, a decent player will never put them all together just ready for the picking, and 600 damage is not that much when compared to the chains many classes get. Multiple forum posts confirm that.
Gunner's Mate
Dec 16, 2009
212
Darth JT on Oct 6, 2015 wrote:
Again, because there is a fist icon, you are assuming it only reduces weapon power, this is not accurate. I have seen and tested this, it reduces spell attacks by half. Hence the talent being called Witch Hunter, not Melee Hunter or Weapon Hunter.

Already troubled class? Other people are saying now because of Old Scratches Boost, Witch Doctors are ranked 2 in PVP, so which is it? Impossible to defeat any melee class with witch hunter trained? Impossible? really, so no witchdoctor is winning at all, or is this an extreme exaggeration?

WitchDoctor's also get teleport so you don't always have to run everywhere. Mojo Storm, a spell that hits 9 squares and can naturally do over 600 damage to all 9 squares, more when boosted. again, you are over exaggerating which is not helping your cause.

You do realize that it takes 5 practice points to train witch hunter, sounds to me, like that is 5 practice points well used if you can "Always" defeat any witchdoctor of any skill.
I just went and tested it again. Witchhunter does not reduce spell power-only weapon power.
Bosun
May 10, 2010
396
I am not sure how many of you have played this game through on a witch doctor, but let me tell ya, fighting against Satyrs on a witchdoctor was never easy. Satyrs have witch hunter and it would activate when using spells and when hit, it would reduce damage of the spells. Wand or staff attacks are not the bread and butter of a witchdoctor, spells are, RatBeard even stated this.

So, the question is, is Witch Hunter not bugged then? Because it should be activated vs spells and should be reducing spell damage, not weapon damage, correct? Hence the name, witch hunter. Make a person even wonder what intuition is for if witch hunter is acting in its place.

So, does witch hunter activate a witchdoctors witch hunter? or does Intuition activate when someone uses witch hunter, because it definitely sounds like there is a bug here and it needs to be fixed.
Gunner's Mate
Sep 30, 2009
240
Silver Angel on Oct 4, 2015 wrote:
Witches dont have the toughness of a bucaneer to fight at 50% or lower health, I think they'd rather heal/drain as fast as they can...
To be quite honest Buc's can struggle at below half health too. It puts you in assassin strike "range" if you will. I mean you are right in a sense they would rather not try that game some like to play where they sort of try to "hover" at half health and shield up. But your missing the point. The point isnt that witches "cant play that half health game" well enough. The point is to help them to clutch a win when all seems hopless and give them a much needed advantage. The point is that when a witch is backed against the wall against a melee guy this would REALLY help.

One...it would help their heals so they can indeed do as you said...heal and/or drain to get BACK UP as fast as possible!

Two...If they want to go for the last ditch hit effort...before they die during their oppoenents next turn...It will increase their mojo reaver!

I am telling you this is brilliant! Cause witches really do need a direct buff just to their school alone. Although...I have my own beef with witch companions as well. I think this move should be installed into ALL witch compaions as well much in the same way buckler companions ALL have allert, or buck companions all have at least tide 1. Witch companions really do get the shaft. I might vent about that in my next post.
Bosun
May 10, 2010
396
Ratbeard on Oct 1, 2015 wrote:
Witch Hunter is unlike other talents, in that it works regardless of what weapon you have equipped. It is not analogous to Quick Draw, First Strike, or Intuition.

Tell me more about this opponent. What was his rank?

He invested a talent point just to defend against witchdoctors, and it was still a close fight?

He's probably feeling pretty good about that investment.

I would not want Witch Hunter to provide an outsized advantage to an inferior player, but neither should the investment of a talent point be trivialized.
Quick Draw is supposed to be a pre counter to shooty weapon attacks, First Strike a pre counter to melee attacks, what is the point of intuition if Witch Hunter is working against both spell and staffy attacks and why is it reducing weapon attacks and not spell attacks when its name is witch hunter?
Gunner's Mate
Sep 30, 2009
240
Ok I know this thread is about witch hunter. But I also feel it has a witch bottom of the barrel how do we give them an edge vibe too. And there is one thing that is really bothering me for a while now and its the witch companions.

Why oh why, was their dodge AND accuracy AND health all lowered? What I have observed is that every companion has an area that is "more boosted" than others...but possibly at the expense of another. Example buckler companions ALL, CONSISTENTLY have both boosted damage AND boosted dodge AND alert...but...they have super low health. Muskets have boosted accuracy at the expense of their dodge. Bucks and privy only main consistent boost is a small health boost. HOWEVER because the buck and privy companions only get one semi health boost...they seem to remain average across the board. They don't DECREASE or anit-buff in one category but remain average. So not having a major boost is ok cause they are the most well rounded. (armor/resist isn't consistent. Some have high but only select few)

But the witches have, count them...THREE anti-boosts for one visible benefit that, lets face it, doesn't really help all that much. Their health is as low as a bucklers...but without the awesome damage boost. This "might" make more sense if they had TONS more mojo...but no...their mojo is = to all the others unless they give up another buff talent for the mojo ones which is lame and doesn't count. They have dodge that is LOWER than a muskets...but no accuracy boost. In fact...for some odd reason they have been pulled WAY BELOW everyone in the accuracy department. This might be ok for witch players who are loaded with 3 pages of 100% accuracy spells and mostly use them the entire time...but witch companions have only 1 or 2 if that...so they kind of NEED to be able to attack normal! And for these 3 drops below average...the only benefit they get is more resist. They have on average 60 resist. Which isnt bad...but is it really worth 3 negative benefits?
Ensign
May 07, 2013
4
ive seen witch hunters summon up to 15 other combatants like the scorpians and skeletons.so i think it kind of evens out
Lieutenant
Aug 29, 2008
146
Darth JT on Oct 7, 2015 wrote:
I am not sure how many of you have played this game through on a witch doctor, but let me tell ya, fighting against Satyrs on a witchdoctor was never easy. Satyrs have witch hunter and it would activate when using spells and when hit, it would reduce damage of the spells. Wand or staff attacks are not the bread and butter of a witchdoctor, spells are, RatBeard even stated this.

So, the question is, is Witch Hunter not bugged then? Because it should be activated vs spells and should be reducing spell damage, not weapon damage, correct? Hence the name, witch hunter. Make a person even wonder what intuition is for if witch hunter is acting in its place.

So, does witch hunter activate a witchdoctors witch hunter? or does Intuition activate when someone uses witch hunter, because it definitely sounds like there is a bug here and it needs to be fixed.
Its called "Witch Hunter" because it activates off of Witch attacks.

Perhaps you are remembering wrong? I am sure most of us who are posting here have gone through the game on a Witchdoctor, that is how we got them to 65 to PvP with. I remember the Satyrs being tough because of their Mojo Echo destroying my companions, not because of their Witch Hunter. Remember that since the Satyrs are Witch units, they might have high resist and that is why you were seeing a lower damage than usual in your Mojo Storms/Mournsongs.

Not sure why you think it is a bug. The power has always stated to reduce weapon power and has always shown to reduce weapon power.

I am personally not familiar with the interaction between Witch Hunter vs Intuition, so perhaps someone else can answer that one.

Either way, I don't think the argument in this thread is about what the power reduces. What makes Witch Hunter the perfect counter vs Witchdoctors is that it is a free attack AND can trigger enemy's epics, all without the enemy having to do anything really. So you're in a position where no matter what you do, you're in a lose-lose situation and kind of locked down.
Bosun
May 10, 2010
396
Alex Hawkins on Oct 7, 2015 wrote:
Its called "Witch Hunter" because it activates off of Witch attacks.

Perhaps you are remembering wrong? I am sure most of us who are posting here have gone through the game on a Witchdoctor, that is how we got them to 65 to PvP with. I remember the Satyrs being tough because of their Mojo Echo destroying my companions, not because of their Witch Hunter. Remember that since the Satyrs are Witch units, they might have high resist and that is why you were seeing a lower damage than usual in your Mojo Storms/Mournsongs.

Not sure why you think it is a bug. The power has always stated to reduce weapon power and has always shown to reduce weapon power.

I am personally not familiar with the interaction between Witch Hunter vs Intuition, so perhaps someone else can answer that one.

Either way, I don't think the argument in this thread is about what the power reduces. What makes Witch Hunter the perfect counter vs Witchdoctors is that it is a free attack AND can trigger enemy's epics, all without the enemy having to do anything really. So you're in a position where no matter what you do, you're in a lose-lose situation and kind of locked down.
Granted, I have only 1 level 65 witch doctor, but I have several 65 pirates and I keep restarting my 6th pirate every time I get to 65, so I know the story and battles better than most. Yes, I know Satyrs have resistance, this was not that, but this is back before pirates could even get witch hunter.

Witch Hunter is supposed to be a counter to witchdoctor spells, not witch doctor wand or staff attacks, hence the name, Witch Hunter. If you want a counter to Witch Doctor wand or staff attacks, that is what intuition is for.

Witch Hunter should be reducing the damage of a Witch Doctor Spell, not a witch doctor staff or wand attack.

However, with Witch Hunter being a spell, it should not be triggering relentless, now should it, regardless of what weapon is being used. Now if Witch Hunter is a spell and a witch doctor has witch hunter, the witch doctor should be able to attack first, correct? So, we need to make sure that KI has the correct order of attacks and keep epics in check and make sure that these talents do what they are supposed to do. That is the purpose of the message boards.
Lieutenant
Feb 02, 2013
119
Darth JT on Oct 7, 2015 wrote:
I am not sure how many of you have played this game through on a witch doctor, but let me tell ya, fighting against Satyrs on a witchdoctor was never easy. Satyrs have witch hunter and it would activate when using spells and when hit, it would reduce damage of the spells. Wand or staff attacks are not the bread and butter of a witchdoctor, spells are, RatBeard even stated this.

So, the question is, is Witch Hunter not bugged then? Because it should be activated vs spells and should be reducing spell damage, not weapon damage, correct? Hence the name, witch hunter. Make a person even wonder what intuition is for if witch hunter is acting in its place.

So, does witch hunter activate a witchdoctors witch hunter? or does Intuition activate when someone uses witch hunter, because it definitely sounds like there is a bug here and it needs to be fixed.
Witch Hunter specifically states an additional attack against magic. That does not mean Spells per say, just magical attacks(Similar to Intuition, except no requirement for weapon type, and Intuition 3 can see hidden magic attacks(only hide w/ basic attacks at the moment(maybe powers, have not tested that yet))). Additionally, Witch Hunter I based on SPELL power(see how much damage Witch Hunter does after you play Scratch's double spell power buff, it does roughly x2 damage), so having a preemptive attack hit before another preemptive attack and nerf the first attack makes no sense(I think they should change that but regardless, that is how it is).

Witch Hunter chains to itself, unlike Intuition, so there is a point to have it(speed of talent v. potential to nerf a magical attack) You could see a reduced damage afterwards because they have resistance, which can change the total damage output.

Witch Hunter only activates against another Witch Hunter if both are using staffy weapons. if you have intuition, that also chains to Witch Hunter, which should be warranted because it is supposed to be faster than tier 1/2 attacks(but not Witch Hunter)

Although reduced spell power could be a nice tier 4 (I mentioned it already on the forums once)
First Mate
Dec 29, 2012
479
I have to LOL at this thread. While there are some good points about Witch Hunter in here, don't people realize that we are currently in the "Mojo Apocalypse"??...the age of the Witchdoctor? ...(and Witch Hunter is our divine intervention against them????).

For those that have forgotten over the last few weeks, please see the below thread about Old Scratch's new power giving rise to WDs and Privs in the PvP arena (where Mournsong/Mojo Storm does a billion damage, summons single handily destroy entire teams and there is no defense (and no hope) against a 1000 Spell Power (i.e. Spooky does NOT mean Happy Halloween). Thank the stars we have Witch Hunter to combat the apocalypse upon us.

https://www.pirate101.com/forum/the-spar-chamber/how-ki-jumped-the-gun-with-old-scratch-8ad6a4144fb13550014fd5e5244707cb/8ad6a4144fb13550014fd5e5244a07cc#8ad6a4144fb13550014fd5e5244a07cc

I'm confused, is Witch Hunter just a problem with Musketeers? Based on comments I've seen from melee...it shouldn't be a problem with them:

"If I even get close to a witchdoctor I will get completely creamed by hits..." - Buccaneer

"a witchdoctor can hit me from a distance where my witch hunter won't work" - Buccaneer

".....the Witchdoctor hit us all with a super Mojo Storm. Just like that my whole team was down to half health before we could even move.....I was dead before I could even cross the battle board.....Melee units need to be able to approach the enemy to hit them." - Swashbuckler

"As it is now, I am never afraid to charge a Witchdoctor with my melee units because I know as long as I don't stand next to them (Reaver), they won't do much damage to me." - Melee (multiple)

"In my opinion, if the swash can get in range, its R.I.P for the witchdoctor. But, if the witchdoctor keeps their distance, they have a good chance to win." - Swashbuckler

"I think Witchdoctor is OP enough now that Old Scratch's top 2 tiers of Mojo Flow now buff Spell Power..." - Witchdoctor (oops)

cont....
First Mate
Dec 29, 2012
479
If I was a developer, I wouldn't know what an actual problem was given all these counter complaints all the time. Additionally, if I did listen to all the complaints, the PvE crowd would lose out the most (the servers would be brought down nightly to ninja nerf). Besides, I would be too busy addressing real OP issues like Hurl Knives...
Gunner's Mate
Sep 30, 2009
240
Darth JT on Oct 7, 2015 wrote:
Granted, I have only 1 level 65 witch doctor, but I have several 65 pirates and I keep restarting my 6th pirate every time I get to 65, so I know the story and battles better than most. Yes, I know Satyrs have resistance, this was not that, but this is back before pirates could even get witch hunter.

Witch Hunter is supposed to be a counter to witchdoctor spells, not witch doctor wand or staff attacks, hence the name, Witch Hunter. If you want a counter to Witch Doctor wand or staff attacks, that is what intuition is for.

Witch Hunter should be reducing the damage of a Witch Doctor Spell, not a witch doctor staff or wand attack.

However, with Witch Hunter being a spell, it should not be triggering relentless, now should it, regardless of what weapon is being used. Now if Witch Hunter is a spell and a witch doctor has witch hunter, the witch doctor should be able to attack first, correct? So, we need to make sure that KI has the correct order of attacks and keep epics in check and make sure that these talents do what they are supposed to do. That is the purpose of the message boards.
That is kind of a valid point. The fact is witch hunter hurts not only the witch but witch companions a ton. As I pointed out above witches already get the shaft. And now if a witch tries to attack with their measly hits...since they dont have cards...even THOSE are reduced to do almost no damage.

And with no dodge odds of witch hunter missing are VERY small. So this is just another way that witch companions have gotten the shaft. Aside from scratch...what is the point of any of the witch companions any more with so many deficits.
Lieutenant
Dec 19, 2011
133
Once again, I lost due to witch hunter. I was facing a buckler, he had 600 life and no shields. I had around 300 life and a triton song. I could have defeated him with a reaver, but instead he got an epic witch hunter hit to beat me. Like I have said many times, this is not fair, because if i did not attack him, he could have killed me with a melee attack the next round, and I would have no way to strike him first.
Lieutenant
Nov 21, 2010
103
Why this hasn't been addressed yet?

It is obvious that whole class suffers because of this talent. Class that is already struggling in current meta.

I would like to add that Witch Hunter is boosted by spell power, and classes that use Old Scratch benefits from Mojo Flow in one more way beside heals and Valor's Armor. What happened with helping out Witchdoctors?

As a matter of fact I have difficulties using Old Scratch because Melee units are training witch hunter.

Buccaneers chain of hits after witch hunter hit is seriously too much.

I played against Buccaneer. He used movement boost to whole team. I placed Ratbeard in front and summoned Cottas next tome. In other words I tried to defend from charging with HtL barrier. He charged with Goronado, almost killed my Ratbeard and approached with other two comps. I managed to save Ratbeard, kill 2 out of 3 comps, but then he charged at Old Scratch, hidden (run past my pet with scent 2 and remained hidden). I tried to hit him with Old Scratch, he died bcs Witch Hunter activated, I went to yellow bcs of the chain hits.

Once he was next to us I wasn't able to hit him, bcs of the Witch Hunter. And this is where all fall apart. He, killed me and full health Exeter with reckless frenzy (I had Levi Call on and he was under the Musk Mettle, -50% Weapon power). Not to mention that I had to buy Exeter in order to manage against other classes in current meta.

Can you please make witch hunter be activated with only staffy or staffy hybrid weapons? Then, our witch hunter can activate too and at least lower the weapon power before we take serious chain of hits.

Sincerely,
Stubborn Duncan Freeman
2